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杉村博文

杉村博文

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sugimura@osaka-gaidai.ac.jp

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只看楼主 2004-02-18 22:56

这首诗有英语译文吗？

下面抄录了郭沫若的《鹭》，请大家注意一下第一个“又”和第二、三个“又”的用法。

鹭鸶！鹭鸶！
你自从哪儿飞来？
你要向哪儿飞去？
你在空中画了一个椭圆，
突然飞下海里，
你“又”飞向空中去。（第一次飞向空中）
你突然“又”飞下海里，（第二次飞下海里）
你“又”飞向空中去。（第二次飞向空中）
雪白的鹭鸶！
你到底要飞向哪儿去？

这首诗有英语译文吗？我很想知道英语是怎么翻译第一个“又”的？《现汉》“又”的八个
义项似乎都不能把这种用法概括进去。

#1

大中小

林璋

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linzhang@fjnu.edu.cn

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2004-02-19 21:10

我觉得是一样的

你在空中画了一个椭圆，
突然飞下海里，
你“又”飞向空中去。（第一次飞向空中）

我觉得，这个“又”跟其它2个一样，都表示重复。

鹭鸶不是一开始就在天上的，因此在鹭鸶“在空中画了一个椭圆”之前，就已经完成一次
“飞向空中去”的动作。
这样，“你“又”飞向空中去。（第一次飞向空中）”中的“又”就不是第一次了。

#2

大中小

凌璧君

凌璧君

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christine_lily@yahoo.com.cn

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2004-02-19 21:44

又...又 .../both ...and ...

这个“又”的用法是不是与“他又吃饺子又吃面条。”的“又”差不多？
表示两件事情都做了，“又飞下海里，又飞向空中。”

#3

大中小

杉村博文

杉村博文

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sugimura@osaka-gaidai.ac.jp

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只看楼主 2004-02-20 00:14

可以默认的“第一次”

林璋先生、凌璧君先生，谢谢你们的回复。林先生说得对，有一定的上下文“第一次”是可
以默认的。再向二位请教一下，在不明说“第一次”的情况下用“又”，是不是有那么一点
“出乎意料”的语气呢？请比较下面[1][2]里的“站起来”和“又站起来”。这一点，也许
会跟凌先生的意见发生一定的关系。

[1] 夏亦秋从来没看过任何体育比赛，更不用说同一个男人坐在一起去看足球赛。然而，她
没有拒绝，而且蓝海的态度似乎也不允许她提出任何异议。也许，他从来没想到夏亦秋是否
同意。
［他们坐在看台上］，足球赛早已经开始。……。只有蓝海，却一直石头似地在那里坐
着，抿着嘴不发一声，只有一个小个子球员栽倒的时候，他的身体微微动了一下。夏亦秋见
他紧紧捏起了拳头。
球场上，那躺倒在地的小个子球员抱着腿在翻滚，夏亦秋怕他是胫骨骨折。场外的医生
抬着担架跑进场去，夏亦秋也想跟进去。她下意识地［站起来］，却感到蓝海强有力的手把
她按住。她推了一下蓝海的手，发觉他的手心湿漉漉的。
这时候，全场一片欢呼。夏亦秋朝球场上一看，原来是那个小个子球员已经［站起
来］，拐着一条腿在地上蹦跳，然后，又跑几步。……

[2] ……年轻人确信没自己的事了，……脚也站酸了，便拣了旁边一只椅子［坐下］。椅子
上有水，他［又站起来］，摸着裤子，举目四望，感到一切都出乎意料、令人费解。他摇摇
头，［又坐下来］。

#4

大中小

niina

niina

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zhang@zas.gwz-berlin.de

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2004-02-20 12:06

then

All of your data are natural. I don't feel any "unexpectedness" flavor.

The word YOU in your data can be regarded as a conjunctive adverb that denotes
a consecutive relation, similar to the English word /then/. Semantically, it
links two eventualities (eventuality is a general term to cover both event and
state). So, it should not be able to start a discourse.

#5

大中小

杉村博文

杉村博文

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sugimura@osaka-gaidai.ac.jp

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只看楼主 2004-02-20 15:08

How it links

Thank you for your answer!
My doubt is as follows when expressing it in other words.

It is needless to say, generally speaking, that the conjunctive adverb
need not be used in Chinese, if the previous event/state and the following
event/state are in the consecutive relation just as example [1] shows. Why was
YOU purposely used in example [2]? This is my doubt. And I think this
phenomenon will be able to be analyzed as follows:
In example [2], there is [zuo-xia] just before [zhan-qilai], and [zuo-xia]
makes you expect the state of [zuo-zhe] to continue for a while. However, it
did not continue long enough as you expected, and there happened an unexpected
new situation [zhan-qilai] ---- it is unexpected just because it means the
return to former state meaninglessly. YOU was used to express the contradiction
of this kind, and the usage originates from YOU's prototype meaning ----
coexistence of two eventualities.

#6

大中小

陆丙甫

陆丙甫

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bingfu@usc.edu

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2004-02-20 15:38

可以问英汉翻译邮件组

这个问题，不妨去问一下英汉翻译邮电组：
有关信息，可从
http://www.usc.edu/dept/LAS/ealc/chinling/fanyi.htm
获得。

此外，以前也看到过专门讨论英语-汉语翻译的网站，但现在不记得具体网址了，
不知有谁知道的。

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#7

大中小

niina

niina

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zhang@zas.gwz-berlin.de

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2004-02-20 16:24

a hot topic in English

As far as I can see, the conjunctive adverb YOU can denote the following
relations, in addition to the eight relatios listed in the dictionary Xiandai
Hanyu Cidian.

1. Consecutive, as in your (1). This is also the meaning of YOU in your poem.
2. Repetitive, as in your (2). This seems to be similar to the first item
listed in the dictionary.
3. Restorationary, as the follwong (3) shows:
(3) 你怎麼把門又關上了！我昨天好容易才打開它。

The distinction between repetitive and restorationary meaning of /again/ in
English was a hot topic in semantics.

Obviously, YOU has more functions than /again/.

I still think the "unexpected"meaning of your (2) comes from the context, not
YOU per se. As you said, the consecutive YOU is optional. But both repetitive
and restorationary YOU are obligatory. Am I right?

#8

大中小

杉村博文

杉村博文

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只看楼主 2004-02-20 18:53

context calls for you

You are right. Both repetitive and restorationary YOU are obligatory, because
they are, in my conception, the marked situations from the consecutive point of
view. Such situations are not achieved if the agent doesn't have a strong
motive for putting them into practice, and it is difficult/unable to express
them without grammatical meanings especially when they are emotional ones.

As for the “unexpected” meaning of YOU, I think it should be said that the
context calls for the word YOU to express the unexpectedness rather than to say
the unexpectedness comes from the context, and YOU has a primitive meaning from
which unexpectedness can be derived.

I am really obstinate! (^_-)

#9

大中小

林璋

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linzhang@fjnu.edu.cn

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2004-02-20 23:47

同一状态的重复

按我的语感，这两个例子都感觉不到“出乎意料”的语气。

例(2)的两个“又”都表示重复，但是属于两种不同性质的重复：“又站起来”可解释为
“同一状态的重复”，即站立状态（站起来的结果）的重复，而不是动作本身的重复；
“又坐下来”属于同一动作的重复，跟前面说的那首诗歌的“又”一样。

下面这个例子可以典型显示这种“同一状态的重复”，因为“恢复”只发生一次。但是，
同样的状态却出现了2次：有信号状态--中断状态--有信号状态。

伊拉克国家电视台26日在巴格达遭到轰炸后中断播出，三个小时后又恢复了信号。

#10

大中小

niina

niina

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zhang@zas.gwz-berlin.de

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2004-02-21 09:37

對！不可能有意外含意

如果/又/本身有意外含意，下面這句話就應該是病句：
老王去年改行經商，現在呢，正如我所料，他又幹起本行了。

The adverb YOU is not specified with any unexpectedness feature. It is
compatible with both expected and unexpected eventualities. If there is any
unexpected meaning expressed in a certain sentence, it comes from other
elements of the sentence or context.

I am also obstinate...

What Prof. Lin labeled "repetition of state" is exactly what the
term "restorationary" means. I agree with him.

#11

大中小

荏苒

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2004-02-24 07:10

又哭又笑,又打又闹,又抹脖子又上吊

好像可以看作表几种情况同时存在,即第二个义项的b。

#12

大中小

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